The Welsh Coast Pioneer and Review for North Cambria

CARNARVONSHIRE EDUCATION COMMITTEE. DUAL v. SEPARATE SCHOOLS. MR ISSARD DAVIES' STRONG DENUNCIATION OF MIXED SCHOOLS. BANGOR NORMAL COLLEGE. NEW COUNTY SCHOOL REGULA- TIONS CONDEMNED. A meeting of the Carnarvonshire Education Committee was held to day week at I Carnarvon. The Chairman (Mr D. P. Williams) presided, and the attendance included Mrs Parbishire, Mrs Jones (Ceridw«n Peris), Rev. Ceidiog Roberts, Messrs Issard Davies, William George, C. H. Darbishire, J. T. Jones, R. B. Ellis, John Owen, R. Jones Roberts, Rev. O. G. Owen, Messrs R. Roberts, Allanson Picton, Abel ,Williams, P. Mclntyre, R. O. Jones, Richard Davies, W. G Thomas, and J. R. Pritchard, with the Secretary (Mr E. R. Davies) and the Assistant Secretary (Mr David Thomas). PAYMENT OF CONTRACTORS. Mr J. T. Jones complained of the non-pay- mont ot the contractor for the Tromadoc school, although the work had been almost completed, but the Architect replied that thero remained a little work to be done. Mr Darbishire, the chairman of the Building Committee, hoped that no money would be paid until the whole of the work was done, and several members said that it would not be right to go behind the back of the architect. It was decided to make a grant of J650 as part of the contract. PROPOSED NEW SCHOOL AT TALYSARN. The R v. Ceidiog Roberta moved that an in- quiry be held into an application for a new school at Tan'rallt, Talysarn. The inhabitants of the plce, he said, were prepared to provide a temporary building and a play-ground. The South Carnarvonshire Committee was in- structed to hold an inquiry. THE FINANCES. A REDUCTION IN THE RATES. In presenting the report of the Finance Com- mittee, Mr Richard Davies stated that it was re- commended that immediate steps be taken to borrow L3000. The Board of Education had sanctioned the sale of consols to that amount, but, as was known, consols were now at a very to webb, and it struck the oommittee that it would be a sacrifice to sell them at present, and they had decided to recommend the Board of Education to vary the sanction and to give per- mission to borrow temporarily from the bank, lay, £ 5000. This recommendation was agreed to. Proceeding, Mr Davies said that the Finance committee had been wondering whether they could do with less money, as the county fund Was so large. There was one item of C3000 in the expenditure for repairs and alterations, and as they knew, schemes intended for the present year had been shelved, so that they could safely say that the committee would not re- quire JS1500 of that :£3000, and there might be reductions under other heads. Therefore, the Finance Committee could do with a penny less in the rates than was anticipated six months ago, but, of course, he could not say that the county rates would be reduced. Replying to Mr W. G. Thomas, Mr Davies said that there were several things which would relieve the committee financially to a certain ex- tent, next year. They had borrowed in order to obtain a working balance, but of that amount they had already paid £3000, and there remained only a balance of L4000 unpaid, and they had two years in which to pay that sum. Under the circumstances he did not think they would have to ask for more money next year. Mr W. G. Thomas referred to the proposed new scale of salaries for the teachers, and asked whether the Finance Committee had re- membered it? The Chairman: It cannot be put into immedi- ate operation. Mr Richard Davies: No, not until after March 31st. PRIZES COMMITTEE. Upon the recommendation of the Prizes Com- mittee, a Birmingham firm was selected to supply the books, and Mr Hughes, Carnarvon, the medals, as prizes for the school children. THE TRANSFERENCE OF BANGOR NORMAL COLLEGE. rA letter was read from the Anglesey Educa- tion Committee concerning their representation on the proposed committee who are to oontrol the Bangor Normal College in future, and claim- ing four representatives instead of three, accord- ing to the present scheme. The Secretary explained that according to the scheme Carnarvonshire appointed eight and An- glesey four representatives, and the twelve selecttd another four. .-4 It was arranged that Anglesey should have four representatives. DUAL SCHOOLS v. SEPARATE SCHOOLS. A REMARKABLE DISCUSSION. Mr Issard Davies, in accordance with notice of motion, moved:—"That no existing dual ele- mentary schools be converted into mixed schools, and no now mixed schools be built where the average attendance, actual or prospective, justifies a dual school." Supporting Lie motion, Mr Issard Davies said he once beard the Chaarman express an opin- ion contrary to his resolution, and he also said that plans of new schools would be in pureu- ance of that opinion, but still tie (Mr Davies) did not think the committee were pledged to that policy in any way. and he for one was dis- tinctly and emphatically opposed to it, and hcped thet the committee would not adopt a policy so retrograde. The old School Boards, v"hen tluy decided' to build schools in the coun- try districts, provided separate schools for the two ect.es, and that policy was recognised -nd appreciated by the parents, by the churches, and by the Education Department, and no doubt the motive which prompted them was to bring up fche children in as pure an atmosphere ea possible; to bring them up under the best InR"An" of the teachers. He supposed no one ■would accuse the old School Boards of being extravagant; in fact they were often blamed for being parsimonious. He maintained that thiftso old School Boards, composed of men who were tihe leadens of religious opinion in their midst were more in touch with the parents and the otiildren a.nd the religious life of the com- munity than they, oentrahsed ai -hey were.couid jjossibiy be. It waa a difficult matter and delicate one to discuss, but he might say that tihe state of tlhings which existed around then was not what it should be. It degraded them as a nation, it sapped the very foundation of the national oharacter. it poisoned the stream of educational life at its very fountain head, 4nd unless they as an educational body, did their duty—and he maintained bliat it was their —Welsh education would simply prove tho vkfition of a thin veneer to a very indifferent ifaaracter. They could not hide their heads like ostriches in the sand and blind themselves to the existence of these things; they did x- ist. -Though at the risk of beinsr told that he was 3rawing- an exaggerated picture, wished to refill for corroboration of what he had said no a case which occurred in the Carnarvon Police Court not a month ago. In that case evidence was given of a state of things existing among the elder children in the elemen- tary schools, which was painful to listen to and humiliating to them as an educational body. and the worst feature of the business was that 8UCh evidence was given by children of twelve With unblushing offrontery indioating hardened vice. It was useless to point to the churches, chapels and other religious Organisations, and blame them for the existence of such things The point, was that Sunda-f Sohools a.r.d home Influences so far had been unable to cope with Jhese evils, and tJiev amould remember that to oalf the children of the elementary sohools the term "home influence" had no meaning. The only remedy they could look to was the teach- er. the only men and women who could lead these forlorn children. But they had NEVER GIVEN THE TEACHER FAIR PLAY. What influence oould a teacher have on a class <>f say 40 to 50 children even if Uiey bo of his or her sex. He maintained that it was impossibb in a mixed school for any teacher to impress Upon tbe children in theiir charge the beauty of PL pure life and the horror of anything degrad- lng. There were gran't earning subjects wlllCh could not be taught to mixed classes. They depriving tihemselves of what wa6 best iii their teachers—direct personal influence upon child. Education was not a matter oe teaching a few rules of arithmetic, a little geo- graphy ttc.; its object was to build characters, and in regard to this matter they in Wales had special mission. -He no doubt would be told jhat, ,n London the echools were mixed, in a6,1''100' atK' ln ^w>t If 'id also. Mr Allanson Picton (interposing): And in America also. Mr Issard Davies: Yes. and in America. But Co we look to London for examples? Surely we <ibn't look to Scotland for an ideal moril ot-andat-d ? Proceeding, Mr Daviea said that Mr Picton «ad referred to America. Yes, in the Western Spates mixed schools obtained, but tlwy were popular v ith the parents, and if the Mose|ey y^nnussion was of any vaiue whatever it ehow- d quite distinctly that the trend of opinion j 501 against the system. The argument in f>vour of dual sohools was that they were mo;e "but were they reallv titoie ecoro- liJk «• i 1*4 in h.is possession a report ub- locally showing that mixed schools wer1 rrT8 sxpensiue than separate schools. Whereas 'n a m'*ed school cost £ 1 6s 2d .n ^J^parate sohool each child cost only £ L So, 0*4 on tihe 6coro of economy it would be oefc- ter for them to stick to separate schools (cries of "No. no"). He had his figures from the re- port, and he did not know whether the oommit- tee disputed it. No doubt. Mr Picton would tell them that eduoaion was over so mudh bet- ter in t'he mixed schools than in the separate schools. If that was so, how was it that thi cultured classes always sent their children Lo separate schools? Mr Picton: They a.re finding it out. Mr Issard Davies: I don't think so. I can- not imagine that we shall have mixed schools in Eton, Harrov, and Shrewsbury- Mr Picton: They are olid-fashioned (laugh- ter). Mr Issard Davies: They may be old- fashioned, but are we going to force upon the children of the elementary schools what the upper classes hesitate to do with their children? Mr J. T. Jones (Oriocieth): We mix them in tihe intermediate sohools. Mr Issard Davies: In the intermediate schools the cla&ses are seldom over fifteen and even as low as five or six. Now I hope that this oom- mittee will insist upon the same pure atmos- phere in the elementary cchools as you insist upon in the schools to which you send your children. Mr Richard Davies (Portmadoc): What con- taminates the atmosphere? Mr Issard Davies: I have told you. The Chairman: In regard to the case you refer to I may say that the schools at Carnarvon are separate. If they had been mixed the cir- cumstances would have been different Mr Issard Davies: I want to point out that the teachers have not had fair-play. Continuing, Mr Davies said that the effect of dual schools was to exclude 75 per cent. from the profession. They might say that they appointed female head teachers, but what was the truth. A female teacher was appointed at Beddgelert, and Mr Pierce made an appeal to every available oourt that he could against it. They were also face to face with another growing evil. CIGARETTE SMOKING BY SCHOOL CHILDREN. Almost every urchin that they -saw in the street sucked a cigarette, and they saw not only the children of the elementary schools indulging in the habit, but also many ladies in higher positions, who tried to hide their hand soiled with the tell-tale nicotine in gloves, showing them to be declared victims of the pernicious habit. It would be a most retrograde move on their part to depart from the policy of the old School Boards; let them better it if they oould. Let them do away with the large standards, and so bring their teachers more in direct con- tact with the child, and only until then would they be able to sweep away the evils he had referred to Mrs Jones (Ceridwen Peris) seoonded the motion. She said that the present arrangement was unfair to the head mistresses of the oounty; that was evident on the face of it, and naturally they could not secure the best head mistresses if only seoondary places awaited them. It was quite soon enough for women to be subservient to men when they got married. Mrs E. P. Hughes, the well-known authority, had stated that a girl's health was not so well looked after if a man was at the head of a school, and it was only necessary to obtain an illustration of this point to witness the girls at the desks. They were allowed to bend in a most unhealthy way. Naturally men did not take the same interest in the health of girls as women would, and it was difficult for a girl's womanliness to be de- veloped when taught by a headmaster, who generally did not choose good models. In America the mixed schools were not popular with the parents. They all knew that; the mothers were all opposed to such schools. Mr Issard Davies: And the hand that rooks the cradle rules the world. Proceeding, Mrs Jones said that if parents wished to send their girls to any of the well- known girls' schools in North Wales, they had to apply for places a considerable time in ad- vance, thus showing how popular these plaoes were. Parents wanted their girls to be amidst pure influences for many reasons other than could be mentioned at that plaoe. Besides female teachers had very little choice for head mistress-ships; naturally, no men would aooept I posts under them, "and I would not admire any man who would," added Mrs Jones, who went on to complain of the small provision made for cookery classes, and she instanced the new school at Trevor, where, she said, the room in which cookery classes were to be held was far too small. Rev. Ceidiog Roberts, alluding to the report quoted by Mr Issard Davies as showing how more economical separate schools were than mixed schools, described it as a "disreputable report." He had a good recollection of the report, which was drawn out in connection with the Penvgroes School, and it was torn into shreds at a meeting of the Sohool Board. It was utterly misleading, and it was proved oon- clusively that mixed schools wore more economical than separate sohools. Mr Issard Davies: The report was adopted by a public body. Mr Abel Williams (Pwllheli) confessed that he was rather puzzled by the resolution. He was rather sorry that Mr Issard Davies had adopted such an attitude, and that his old pupil teacher, Mrs Jones, had also gone that way. His ex- perience as a schoolmaster, and as the head of a tamily led him to isnak in favour of mixed schools. He had wished Mr Davies could have spoken with greater authority. With some people separate schools was quite a whim but it was a whim to which he was strongly opposed. In the intermediate schools the mixed system had been adopted as the best system. He had found that fewer men went on the wrong path when they were brought up in mixed families, and the mixing of the sexes in his opinion promoted increased respect for one an- other In the playground he agreed that they should be separate, but not in classroom. The presence of girls balanced the minds of boys at a foolish age. MIXED SCHOOLS ADVOCATED. Mr Allanson Picton said he quite concurred with the remarks of Mr Abel Williams. Through- out his speech Mr Issard Davies seemed to as- sume that what they meant by mixed schools were schools where boys and girls were always mixed together; where girls were not under family influences, and where they could only look to men to direct them. They had no idea of such schools; all they wanted were schools where boys and girls could be profitably brought up to- gether for certain lessons. They had no de- sire to mix the boys and girls without proper supervision, but what they urged was that ex- perienced and educated ladies should be I specially detailed to look after the interests of the girls, about whom Mrs Jones had spoken, but they must not confound the two things.' Mr Davies had constantly spoken of dual schools, but their school at Llandudno, which was to be opened shortly, was called a dual school because it contained both boys and girls, but the girls were under the superintendence of an assistant mistress. Mr Davies did not propose that they should do away with mixed schools because the county could not afford it, but if the case was as strong as he put it there should not be a mixed school, however small the child popu- lation in any village throughout the county. Mr Davies had also stated that in a small school the children were better looked after; certainly not. If in a large school there was an adequate staff, the organisation must be such that the child was brought wi<hin the particular supervision of some teacher. As to the statement regarding class dis- tinctions, he always thought they were done away with now. He had sent a boy of his to a mixed school, and he was convinced that not only were the children who attended mixed schools better fitted educationally but morally than those in the separated schools. He was rather sorry to hear Mr Davies say that half the children in their elementary schools had no family interest. Wales was said to be characterised by more home life than any other part of the United Kingdom, and more people attended places of worship in Wales than in any other part of the United Kingdom, and did Mr Da- vies mean to say there was no family influence in the homes of the people who visited so often the places of worship? Of course, there were variations, but taking them on the whole he totally denied that there was any lack of that family influence to which Mr Davies had referred (hear, hear). The children were also meeting together in the streets, and if they were separa- ted in the schools, would it not lead to great cur io"ity } In his opinion, in mixed schools lay the future of education. Mr R. O. Jones supported the motion. Mr J. T. Jones (Criccieth) said that the evii was to be fowd in those homes where there v ere not sufficient accommodation, and he could irstance Many sncii case. which had come before him in his capacity as a Guardian. Mr R. B. Ellis lefuted the statement that the old School Boards built only separate schools. He was not opposed to separate schools in towns tut in lhe villages they were not practicable, Such schools led to the introduction of ihferior teachers, and what they wanted in the country districts were certiicatcd teachers, so that their schools might be in a position to compete with the town schools. What struck him most when iiting the American schools was the politeness of the boys to the girls. Whenever a girl wished to leave the room the door was politely opened by one of the boys. The evil spoken of by Mr Davies did not gc-ijoi ate in the schools, but in the slums with their overcrowded houses. Mr J. R. Pritchard (Cainarvon) said he no- ticed that the Board of Education had sent an intimation to a Lancashire Authority that sepa- rate intermediat} school must be provided for keys and gim. Mr Richard Davies (Portmadoc) pointed out that the case quoted by Mr Issard Davies re- lated to a town where the schools were separate, so that Mr Issard Davies' argument was of no avail. Could anyone say that the children from the rural districts wore more wicked than the children of the urban districts. If that was so it was their duty to abolish the separate school. Replying to the discussion, Mr Issard Daviea said that a great deal had been made of the system which obtained in America, but several of the experts who accompanied the Moseley Commission did not praise it. Professor Arm- strong said he was struck with the low average of attainment in the higher schools, which, he said, was due in a large measure to the preva- lence of mixed schools. Mr Fletcher also did not think that the system v. as one to be copied. After all, th-y were not the only people to de- I cide the matter; it was an important matter for th 1 parents, and he thought the voice of the churches should also be heard upon it. The Chairman: They have a voice when they return membari. Mr Issiid Davies said that the reason why they had separate achools in Carnarvon was be- cause of their povorty, and not because of their wealth (hear, hear). Soveti voted for the motion and twelve agiiinst. Mr Issard Davies thought that the opinions of the parents and the churches should be obtained. Rev. Ceidiog Roberts: No, ro. Mr Isiard Davies: I'm surprised to hear Mr Ceidioif Rob-art j discrediting his own cloth. LEAD STEALING AT CARNARVON. It wa decided to offor a reward of jS5 for in- formation leading to the apprehension of the per- sons who stole E8 worth of lead from the roof of the Carnirvou Council School. ENTRANCE SCHOLARSHIP EXAMINA- TIONS. Rev. Ceidiog Roberts moved that the resolu- tion adopted by the Education Committee, varying the ago limit in connection with the Entrance Scholarship Examinations for Lle County Sclioola be rescinded. He csa-id that the resolution was parsed in haste. Mr Abel Williams seoonded. At tihe invitation of the Chairman. Mr D. Thomas, the assistant secretary, snoke and re- ferred to the proposal as a retrograde one. The step originally taken by tihe committee was praised by the leading educational journals. The proposal was lest, only the mover and seconder voting in its favour. APPOINTMENT OF GOVERNORS. When tho appointment of governors for the County Schools came up for consideration, it was stated that the Rev. T. E. Owen, rector of Bottwnog. was tihe present representative for the Bottwnog School, and Mr luaard Davies moved his re-election. The name of the Rev. Mr Roberts, a local minister, was proposed, whereupon Mr Issard Daviies pointed out that the sohool was an old Church foundation, and the committee should recognise that faot by electing Mr Owen. Mr R. Davies proposed tihe re-election of the Rov. T. E. Owen, and this was carried. COUNTY SCHOOL NEW REGULATIONS. Mr W. George mentioned the new regulations affecting the County Schools of England and Wales, and said that it was an open question whether Wales would benefit by them. He proposed that re presentat-ions be made to the Welsh Department of the Board of Education with the view of tihe abolition of those restric- tions in the Welsh regulations which operated unfairly on Welsh Secondary Schools, and whiioh did not exist in the English rcrulations. He had received a statement with regard to tihe Portmadoo Sohooil, winch showed tihal under the new regulations thirty students would bring no grants to the school, but if those students were in an English school t.h.'y would earn grants. Again, there were restric- tions with regard to the time-table, which dd not exist in the English schools. Mr Issard Davies seconded1, and said that he had given notice of motion to the County Council on the subjeot. The Welsh schools under the new regulations would receive a grant of JB17 10s, whilst under the same 3ir- oujrptanoes an English school would receive L34. and it was estimated that the Welsh schools would lose £20,000 a year by the regula- tions, the provisions of which, in referring to English schools contained the word "may," but in the case of the Welsh sdhools it was "shall." The recommendation was carried. SATURDAY CLASSES. An examination was held at Carnarvon Council Sohool of those students of the Satur- day classes who failed to attend the- previous examination. The quality of the work was much the same as that prod'uoed in the May examination, and the remarks in the previous report respecting the students wihose names appeared in the third olaa3 applied with equal force here. In the English language paper, the analysis and parsing were comparatively well done, but the students found considerable difficulty in expressing in their own words a passage from Hamlet. The difference between active aind passive verbs was not generally known. IMPROVEMENT SCHEMES. A letter was read from the Board of Educa- tion agreeing to an extension of time allowed by the general scheme for the completion of the repairs and improvements to certain schools on the distinct understanding that all the schools which were to have been dealt with in the oourse of the years 1906 and 1907 shall be com- pletely dealt with by not later than tihe middle of September. 1908; that all the sdhools which were to be dealt with in the year 1908, shall be completely dealt with by not later than the middle of September, 1909: that the work re- quiring to be done to these two classes of schools shall be spread as evenly as may be over the periods assigned to o-ich and not de- layed until near the end' of the respective per- iods; that the thiree schools, Glanwydden, Dol- bada.rn, a.nd Portmadoc (Snowdon-istreet) shall be pu/t in hand first; and tthat a report shall be submitted to the Boa.rd of Education every four months, showing the work in lu. nd at the time of each report, and the progress made gince the preceding report. The department added further that in the event of any failure to proceed with the work with due expedition, they would not, in those cir- cutn&tances, regard the extension cf time now accorded as any longer in operation. They felt sure, however, that they could rely upon the committee applying itself unceasingly to the important work of bringing into a satisfactory condition all the schools for which it was re- sponsible. EVENING SCHOOLS. It was resolved that evening schools be estab- lished during the ensuing session at those schools where last year's average was 20 or more, pro- vided 2l) students are registered for the next session. It was also decided that in cases where classes were not he'd last year that classes be formed in cases where the teacher call guarantee 20 students. It was agreed that teachers of even- ing classes be instructed to submit a scheme of work for a two years' course in the various subjects of instruction, the two years' course being a continuation of the work done last session. With a view to encouraging children who have just left school to continue their studies, it was resolved that no fee be charged in the case of boys and girls who have left school in the course of the year. The remuneration for teachers and the fees payable by students will be the same as t-hcee of last year. TEACHERS' AGREUME'NTS. A letter was read from the Board of Educa- tion requiring that written agreements for the engagement of teachers in voluntary schools be now competed, but adding that the committee need not themselves be a party to the agree- ments, and that it would be open to the man- agers of each school, in completing the agree- ments, to enter therein such rate of salary as is in fact being paid by the committee to the teacher concerned. It was resolved that a com- munication be addressed to all voluntary school managers to this effect. J COUNTY EDUCATION RATES. The Treasurer submitted amended estimate for the requirements of the committee for the I coming half-year, and it was approved, and a I resolution adopted asking the County Council to provide for rates amounting to 4d in the £ for elementary. d for secondary, and id for 1 4 intermediate purposes. MI SO ELLA N EOU S. With regard to the Pwllheli cookery crnfre, it was reso.ved that last year s arrangement a.gain obtain for the ensuing year. ° The Rev. J. M. Dryerre wrote asking per- mission to address during school hours the pupils of the day schools on the "Evils of Smoking," and it was resolved that permission he granted. # The Secretary reported that he had had two interviews with the Board of Education with reference to the terms upon which grants would bo allocated out of the building fund of £100,000 towards the erection of Council Schools, and it was resolved to instruct the secretary to tako all the necessary steps to prepare as many car-es as possible in which applications may bo made, at the earliest moment, for such grants. A letter was read from the correspondent of the Llannor N.P. Sohool protesting agaiin-t the further requirements made by the committee, and intimating that the managers had appealed to the Board of Education to decide the matter. A letter was road, also, from the Board of Education, dated the 4th September, containing the terms of the appeal, and it was resolved that a full explanatory statement be forwarded c' to the Board of Education with particulars of the requirements addressed by the oommittee to the managers.