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to. '1.'1 SJLXlY Y EAite toiiNCE:…

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to. '1.'1 SJLXlY Y EAite toiiNCE: OR IN THE I)AY s OF HEHECC A, Extracts from an old Blue Book relating to Cardiganshire. Being Minutes of Evidence taken before the Commissioners of Inquiry in 1843* The Royal Lrankland Lewis, Robert Henry Clive, and William Cripps Esquires—assembled at Carmarthen on the 25th day <J Oe.'ooer, 18.;3. and /< eleven days heard the evidence of many Tvitn-^tses from Cardiganshire On November 23th, 1843, ktt. THOMAS JONES, MH. DAVID OWEN, and ME. BENJAMIN DA VIES, examined. (To Mr. Jones.) Where do you live?—In the parish of Llangranog. 4)o you all live in the same pansh?- Yes, and we are all rate-payers in the parish. Do you rent landr-Yes. Of whom do you rent?—Mr. Watkin is my landlord. (To Mr. Owen.) Whom do you rent under r I rent of Mr. Saunders Davies, member of Parliament for Carmarthenshire. (To Mr. Davies.) Whom do you hold under ?-Mr. Evans of Lampeter. Have you had much disturbance in your parish?—(Mr. Jones). Yes. Have you any turnpike-gate in your par- ish Y ea it was made on my premises; it was nothing to me, because I did not pay anything. The tumpike-voad from Cardi- gan to Aberystwith went through the middle of my farm. Is the gate now pulled downP-Yes. Who pulled it down ?—I do not know; they say that it was Rebecca, but who Rebecca is I do not know. Did you see it pulled down ?-No. What did the people say who pulled it down?—They said it was not right to remove the gate to the place where it had been re- moved to. The farmers go to fetch culm and .c limo as manure from the shore, and they say that they took the gate about a mile from the place where it was before to this pl;¡r'e to catch those farmers because the other gate was not on their way when they came from the shore. <. m How far from Cardigan is the gate?—1^ miles. AT Is it near the New Inn?—Yes, about a mile; the gate was by the New Inn at fu-st, and they moved it about a mile. How far do those farmers who brought their coal and culm and lime go along the turnpike-road?—Some of them not a quartei of a mile, and some perhaps two or three ""And some 10 miles?—No, not so much as that.. r Is the gate put up again ?-o. Would it be pulled down again if it were put up ?—I cannot say it is nothing to me. Have you heard any talk upon it?-No it was complained that it was very hard that they should pay every third time. What else do you wish to say to the Com- n-iissioners P-Wc, say that the burdens are very heavy upon our farms; the tithes among others. T, What is the matter with the tithe ?—it was heavy before, and it is heavier now. Who is your clergyman ?—Mr Evans, and I am one belonging to his family; wue is a relation. Our clergyman had £ 4 for the parish of Llandisilio-gogo, and when the New Act came in, he said that he must have £ 30 for it. Is it settled ?—None know that; but the landlords, Mr. Saunders Davies and Mr. Jordan, own one-third of our parish. Why do not you go and speak to the land- lords?—(Mr. Owen.) We have been to the landlords. How much more do you pay than you used to pay?— £ 1 10s. I now pay £ 10. I used to pay £ 8 10s.. Have you paid it yet?—Yes, I paid it one year.. When did you pay it?—Last year twice. Why have you not paid it this year?—Lo- morrow he calls his tithes in. The tithes in your parish are very low ?— They are higher than they were before. Jones.) We would like to give every tenth sheaf, and pigs the same as before. The clergyman offered one farmer in the parish to take £7 for his tithes, but he re- fused and had them taken in kind, and they eame to f,17 los?—We have heard that story many timea. Do you believe it?—No. (Mr. Owen.) The clergyman said that the wheat of the farm v. as not fit for his horses. Have you any charge to make against the clergyman?—The tithes are too heavy. Do you think the clergyman has too much ü;, t of the parish?—I do not know what is his due. But you do not think he has too much money e it of your-Yes; our parish is in two divi- sions this man's father has collected the tithe from the part where I am. Do you know that the clergyman has re- ceived threatening letters ?—(Mr. Jones.) Yes, 1 have seen a threatening letter with 10110 clergyman, the clergyman showed it to me at my house. Who wrote them r-l do not know Are you sure you do not know ?—Yes, I (otild take my oath to it. Do you know anything about his curate being beaten ?—Yes, I heard that; that was too bad. Why did they beat him ?—It was far from me; it was not in our parish, but in another parish. Is there any c.ui.sx: of discontent with the clergyman that makes people disinclined to pay him his tithes?—(Mr. Owen.) Only (hat the tithe was too high. Nothing else but the tithe being too high? <—No.—(Mr. Jones.) There is nothing against Mr. Evans as a parson. Is it that you object to pay tithes at all, or that you object to the amount?—lo tne amount. f You do not dispute that he has a lav> rul ight to tithe, just as a landlord has a lali-- ill right to the rent of land?—No, I do not dispute that the law is right to pay tithe. Which religious denomination do you be- >ng to ?-I am a Dissenter.—(Mr. Owen.) 1 am a Churchman. Whether you are churchman, or belonging a dissenting congregation, you do not ietiy that lie has a right to tithe?—(Mr. Junes.) No. When yon quarrel with it, you quarrel itli the amount?—les. Provided the amount was smaller, you would be willing to pay it?—I would. How much has your tithe been increased? <jl 17s. Cd. The clergyman who was here to-day stated -tt before the tithe commutation was settled, he was not assessed to the poor?— Owen.) No, he was not. Then a part of the increase that you com- plain of is money which he pays to the rates, does not go into his pocket?—No. The clergyman stated that- he had paid .37 in the last three years, and received "27 1: he paid therefore more than he re- ceived, 10 IGs. 1 Jones.) That is an error; a great many cases are in the solicitor's ha id, and those men had paid tithes and costs. Has he distrained?—No, but there was a letter from the attorney. The tithe in our parish was one year under another; and when the new commutation came in, the clergyman called for both at the same time; 'I l' 1.- .L. this year we have paid upon the crop or iasl, year, now 111 August or September. Then u have a half-year in hand?—A year in d. It. was the old custom of the parish,, t<i then after the new commutation the clel gyma n comes in and asks for the old year and the now year together. You could not grumble at that?—He ought to wait about a fortnight at least. When you pay icadily, what has lie given you?— (Mr. Owen.) He tells us he will pay ns back 2s. in the pound. Did he do that last time?—(Mr. Jones.) No. Have you soldiers in your parish ?—Yes. Do you know what expense is brought on the county rate by all this? you have the county rate to pay?-Yes, it will be pretty heavy. Have you received any threats from Car- marthenshire. that if yen pay the tithe it shall be worse for you?—I have never re- ceived a threatening letter. Are von under any fear that, if you pay the tithes to the clergyman, people will come and attack you?—No. Do you feel at liberty to pay what is justly due if you pJease ?-Yes; but I think that it. is very heavy. What else have you to say?—About the Poor Law Act. I have been a guardian of our parish for two years. The bastardy clause we object to. How would you have it ?—TTpon the father. What would you do to a woman who had nine bastards by nine different men?—It I ?<, very hard to have witnesses for a secret thing. Nobody knows better than the woman about the father of the bastard. W ill she always tell the truthP-That is for her. I know that our rates are raised a great deal more than they were because we have to pay for the bastard children. You think that it would be better to put the father in prison if he did not pay the money to the parish?—Yes. You think that the parish ought not to be put to any expense on account of bastard children if the father can be got at?—Yes. Another thing I have to complain of is this. Part of our Union is in the county of Cat marthen; and part in Pembroke, and part in Cardiganshire. The parishioners of our parish meet in vestry, and agree to raise the allowance by adding 3d. to the weekly allowance of our paupers and when I propose that in the Board, a guardian from Carmar- thenshire or Pembrokeshire rises up and opposes me, and divides the Board, and he carries it. If the guardian from that other parish -s wanted to raise the allowance to the paupers in his parish, would you not object to that, and vote against him?—I could do so if I liked. And you would do it, would you not ?—No, I would not. Nobody knows better than the guardian of the parish, if the pauper lives in his parish. When did this case happen that you wanted to raise the allowance 3d. a-week p- It was for a widow in our parish. Had she any children?—Yes. Where did she live?—In our parish. In whose house ?—She lives in her own house. Her own freehold?—No. Of whom does she rent it?—I cannot say. What else have you to say ?—Suppose a labourer is out of work, and lie has seven or eight children, they must be starved, or go into the workhouse. The Poor Law will not allow us to give them a little barley to keep them from starving. Why does he not go into the workhouse ?— It is very hard upon him that he should be obliged to go into the house. Then if he goes it will cost ls. 9d. a head, and if he is out it will be only 9d. a head. The Witness withdrtw)

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