The Carmarthen Journal and South Wales Weekly Advertiser

CARMARTHEN ASSESSMENTS. PUBLIC MEETING OF RATEPAYERS. MORE ABOUT RATING INEQUALITIES. pi I C'IM PERSONALITISS-RECRIMINATIONS -& APOLOGIES. FORMATION O? A RATEPAYERS' ASSOCIATION. A largely attended meeting of the ratepayers and ctho?s of (Jarmd.rthen was held at the Assembly Rooms on Monday evening tor the purpose cf form- in" a Ratepayers' Association tor the borough. Tha Mayor (Air. J. Crewman) pros ded, and when ne appeared on the piatiorm, accoinrjanied by Mr. 1>. Wiiiiams, the xvy liush Royai iriottn; ->Ar. H. ±j. B. Richards, Castle House, and Mr. A. lA. Davies (the boru'lgn accountant), ine apptn.us<' was loud and '°TheU\1 aye r, at the outset, stated that he had been summoned by the ratepayers of the town to ca,i that meeting together. He had in Ins hand a petition, signed uy 24 ratepayers, requesting him to cad a meeting, so that they were perfectly m order I'l cuE-e tnere were some persons present who knew not the reasons, or some of them wny they were gathered together, he would at once say tnat by virtue of recent d.sciosures made as to the varia- tion of the town's assessment, there was a strong feeling of disquietude and unrest amongst i-no l-atepayc :s, «•*» ,that, all be T at on the same level (appiause). Now that their aitenuon had been drawn .0 tne anomalies that existed, he thought they had a pert^t nguo to sift tho matter thorougmy, and get to.the ve.y bottom cf it (applause). Ihero was nothing, he, thought, that awakened resentment within one mu.e than°to feel he was unevenly yoKed. He firnuy believed there, was not a rate-caycr in the hall who was not perte.y willing to pay a full of the town's liabilities (applause/—buu he feh tqaally sure that there was no ratepayer there wnc> yas willing to pay his own, and part oi somebody euc s, because that was what it practically amounted to when thev were unevenly assessed They were al made of the same cl.y, and fc-r tliat. they clawed justice and equality (applause).. He was toid tnat the present anomalies existed in the aggregate to something like £ 500,00^. Well,. £ 300, QVJO, if ac.aed to t their assessment would practically reduce tne.r rate* by about lOd. in the £ (applause). That m iteoJ was, fJ.-> his mind, ii true—and he had* he arc. ■nothiii' hitherto to contradict it, and unti| heard that statement authoritatively retuted tney were perfectly justified in believing it was laitti- cient to prove that the step tney were taking that night in forming a Ratepayers' Association was a Sep in the right direction, and worthy of then- consideration (applause). The principal duties oi a RatCDavers' Association were, he understood to ■watch nublic elected bodies, to enhghten if possible, public 'oninion, and, as far as possible, to influence locaj administration, with railway companies in- cluded It was a common comp!a nt that in tne absence of a vigilant public opinion amongst gentle- men who were elected to posts of trust, they were apt to develon a spirit of irresponsibility. If that was so surely the step they were adopting that night could not be but one—witnout reflecting upon anybody—that would produce good results. _rio wanted to publicly th.-itilc Mr. Williams, the Ivy Bush—Coud'apolauEc)—for his manliness—(renewed applause)—his courage, and the impartial way in which he brought that matter forward without the alighted party bias (apniause). Few people would do wha. he had done, because it was quite natural, that an action of that sort would crea.t8 enemies, but Mr. Williams was so built that he was no respecter of persons—(app)ause)—and he is possessed of such a strong sense of right and wrong, and hi3 veins full cf a desire to sorve the public as men xhou! d-(app' ause) -that possibly it would take .our Dreadnoughts to Drevcnt him from dons- so (laugh- ter and apolause). The world was not lac King in men who niaved to the gaHery, but they were sadly in nc-d of men who would reprove and strive to redress what they believe to be wrong. After the resolution that a Ratepayers' Association had been moved and seconded, ho purposed thiowing the meeting ocen for discussion. and would allow each speaker five minutes to speak. He hoped they would not all speak at once, but he promised them he wou'd c-ive'them all an amole opportunity to speak. If that rule was applied they wou'd have had a ve'v profitable meeting, and' he felt sure they wou!d all go home feeling happier for having been there (applause). .MR. D. E. WILLIAMS AND HIS OPPONENTS. Mr. D. E. Williams, who received an ovation on rising LO speak, aaidi Allow me to thank you most heartily for the kmd reception you have given me. It is just twelve months ago since you returned me as one of your representatives for the eastern ward, and I am proud, if in bringing this matter of un- equal assessment forward, you think I have done my duty (applause). There was one thing I am very proud of, and that Is you returned me without going through that unmanly ordeal of canvassing, and if I have given you satisfaction In this, I have reached the height of my ambition (cheers). I wish to thank the Mayor publicly for the very able, determined, and cool manner in which he managed our meeting on April 15th. I can assure you it was no easy task for me. When I got on my legs— I am a very nervous man as you know when I gat on my lega—tho reception I received ws.s enough to upset the strongest-nerved man, especially the reception I received at the hands of three men who know better—three of our leading citizens: three gentlemen who ought to set us good example! three of our borough magistrates (cries of "Shame"). Directly I got on my legs, Messrs. James Davies and John Lewis behaved in a dis- graceful and shameful manner. They tried to put me down ("Shame" and hisses). They called upon the Mayor to demand me to sit down. and rule me out of order, but I am proud to tell you, gentle- men, the Mayor was too strong for them (applause). Certainlv, he' had to speak very harsh to one of the magistrate. and at last demanded him to sit down, a. command which he did not Sinch from giving (cheers). If any of those gentlemen had been Mayor of the town at the time. I should have had no hearing at all ('Shame"). But I don't wish to say anything unkind about or hurt anybody to- night, and all I can say about Messrs. James Davle= and John Lewis—all I wish to say is, it Is unbecom- ing of a man. You all know them as well as I do— (laughter and hear, heart—and my opinion of them is that they came out that night in their true type. Those few, who do not know these two men before that meeting, after reading the true account given in the papers, must come to the truth of what tho&c men are. I was very much astonished at it. In the 6rat olacc. after giving my figures—I expressly named it to the Mayor—1 named No. 56, King street. I was not tailing about the whole of the pronertv. but in going through the books I camp across 'No.. 56. King-street, which constitutes a dwelling-house, shop, and the whole of the printing establishment. In going through the assessment book I found that the dwelling part of the house. let to a lady at a rental of between JB20 and :650 a year. is rated at J612. Looking at the shop and fine printing establishments—I think it one of the finest jjrjntin'g eSt&bVshinents in Carmarthen. It runs down to Wood's-row, and has a frontage of 26 yards. I was never more aston'shed in my life to find tha.t. that part of the establishment, the shop and printing establishment, were rated to the extent of £ 12 (laughter). He got up, trentlemen, and said, "I was making an ass of myself" (laughter). In the nrst niace that was not complimentary, but it did not have much enect on me. I asked the- Mayor tc refer to the Borough Accountant and see if I was correct In my statement, and he gave his verdict in my favour. But what I want you to understand is that Mr. Spurrell tried to mislead the public. He wants to combine all his property together, and take the total assessment of all. I have only men- tioned No. 56, which I still adhere to, and which is only half assessed if you compare, it with the Welshman" and the JoURXAL. I must leave it to the public to decide which is the greater ass—the magistrate or the humble hotel-keener (laughter and applause). I wish to return thanks to Mr. Richards for coming to my rescue. He js the only man in the whole of the Council who had the pluck to come to his rpscue—(applause)—and a most able. butty I found. Without him I don't know what I should have done, because there was not a single member of the Cornoration at that Council meeting-, where we. had that unpleasantness, who supported my motion—(Rev. Joseph Harry: "Question.")—onfy Mr. Richards—(The Rev. Joseph Harry: "Ques- tion') and shouts of "Be quiet" and "Sit down." The Rev. Joseph Harry, amidst excitement, Mid. ''I would like to question tha.t statement now, sir." The Mavor—If vou will kindly make a note of tha.t remark you will have an opportunity to reply later on (applause).. TIT, Mr. D. E. Williams—There is one thing I should like you to understand perfectly, and that is that through what Mr. RIchirda and myself endeavoured to do In carrying this through, we are in the same boat, and we must paddle our own boat, but should you, sl r, In vour boat, with your crew. at present. get shipwrecked, the only member we shall aHow to come into our boat is you, Mr. Mayor, after your manliness at that meeting (applause). I agree with every word the Mayor has said, and I think it would be very beneficial for Carmarthen to form Rate- payers' Association on a good sound basis (ap- plause). I move the resolution that we do iorm such an Association, and perhaps some ratepayers will suoport it. I am anxious that you should all support me strongly in this resolution, which I feel heart and soul in and I hope that somebody will get up and pass a resolution, requesting the Mayor of Carmarthen to call a meeting to insist on having thia town re-assessed, re-valued on a sound basis by a comnetent qualified man (applause). Gentlemen, this is the only way to do it. We can never do it at our Council. It is nn impossibility. I don t mean to say that the Mayor—(A Voice- We must get some fresh blood In next time).—I feel very f.tron°-!y on the noint and I think I am the same as the rest of you. We only want to be all rated en the same sound equal basis. At the present moment- it is la a deplorable eta.tc. After I have finished, my friend, Mr. Richards, will give you a list of a few more of what we term most unjust assessments in the town. The borough accountant is hero with the rate-books, and will answer any questions with regard to the rates with pleasure. should' any gentleman in the room think we have i.is.do a mistake in any of our figures, Mr. Davies is here to give you the right figures. If we have made a mistake we shall be mo-t happy to s.poio- gise. and try to make amends. You, gentlemen of the Press, I want you to grant me another favour, snd you treated me very good last time. I have a sus-gestion to make, and it is only through you, gentlemen, I can get this known. I want every ratepayer in Carmarthen to understand that lie is as much justiued as the flavor in going to the Borough Accountant's Ooicc, and asking to see the rate- books. The cfncial in charge is bound by Act of Parliament to show you the books, or give you the information you require. If any of you go, and can't get the information you want, you come to me, and I promise you you will very soon get it (applause). MR. H. E. B. RICHARDS ATTACKS. Mr. H. E. B. Richards, who was also received with loud anptause. said: I don't think that the pro- meters' of this meeting and its object need be in any way down-hearted. I think this meeting should be and I take it, it is an indication that the rate- payers of the town are fuily alive to the fact that there is something wrong somewhere—(applause)— that a crisis has arisen in the financial operations of this ancient borough. I think the town perceives there is .something wrong in the administration n.s through the Council, and in the local taxation as through the assessable values for rating purposes. I am here to second the resolution to form a. Rate- payers' Association for the town (hear, hear). I think such an Association will have a tendency to get rid of a good many of the controversial matters that are taking up too much of the attention of the Council at the present time. I mean that an Assoc;- ation, and I would like to qualify i tto this extent, a Ratepayers' Association conducted on proper lines, and that'is an Association that is altogether free from ANY PARTY BIAS whatsoever (applause). If we have, and I hope you will decide to-night to form such an Association forthwith, I believe a: each municipal election it will be seen to assure that wo will have the right and best citizens the town possesses to represent, and to stand at the helm of municipal affairs. When I say this, I should like it to be clearly underwood that I make no impeachment, I throw no reflection whatsoever upon tho actions of the present councillors, neither do. I, in tho slightest degree, wish to question the ability of any councillor not sitting in the municipal chamber. I would like to deal with the resolution that was moved by Mr. Williams at the last Council meeting, and which I had the honour of seconding. It was kind of Mr. Williams to make the reference he did to me, but I can assure you all, that I consider it an honour, but not only that, but a duty I owed to the citizens of the town (applause). I honestly consider and believe that the townf-tecplo owe a debt of gratitude to Mr. Williams (applause). I wish to associate myself with the remarks the Mayor so ably made with reference to Mr. Williams. As the Mayor said, it was a very plucky thing to do, and I think all present will agree with me that it takes the highest form of courage to attack injustices so long established, and so strongly fortified as those we are attacking at the present time (applause). No doubt we all know feelings must be hurt, but that is a very natural thing, and quite what you would expect to take place. If I had been in the position occ-upied by some, very probably I should have felt hurt myself (laughter). But as it happens for me I was in the other position. I was in the other canoe—Mr. Williams' canoe—and therefo'-e perfectly safe (laughter). I don't think it was Mr. Williams' intention to hurt anybody's feelings. It simply and solely happened to be that they occupied faulty positions, and therefore, naturally, were open to the attack of anybody who set to work. Now I re- member some months back Mr. Williams approach- ing me on this subject; he mentioned many in- stances which made me think very seriousiv, with the result that I, with him, investigated more close- ly into tho conditions of affaire. On investigation I found the conditions were startling, and so signifi- cant that I determined there and then to throw found the conditions were startling, and so signiG- eant that I determined there and then to throw myself with all my energy in the attempt Mr. Williams was making to- adjust these anomalies (applause). What I wish to attack nrst is the system. You know this position we occupy is a delicate one. Like most people I have no desire to he unjust towards everyone or anyone. I wish to show fair-play for and equal treatment to everyone just as I expect .similar treatment in respect of myself (hear, hear). You know I have in the re- marks and ngures I intend giving you, to mention names in connection with the various properties, but I have to do so in order to locate the property, be- cn.me some ratepayers at the oilier end of the town would not know where such and such a, place was if I I merefy mentioned the number. Where I can I shall avoid mentioning names at all. I wish it to be c'earjy understood that when I associate the names of the landlords or tenants with the property I refer to, I do so to identify it, becauso otherwise it might go out to the public by interested individuals, who would like to throw cold water on the present move- ment. that we are inspired primarily and finally with personal motives. I don't think after that state- ment anything of the kind can be said. Coming to the system, wo have the overseers, the assistant over- seers, and tho county assessment committee ap- lomted by the- guardians. I am of opinion, and I think most In this room are of opinion that the system is wrong somewhere, and that It has been wrongfor years and years; that the method attand- 'ng this system are really at the root of the rise that has been incurred, and that has been steadily place in the rates during the last few vears. I have hoard it said on many occasions that the loor Town Councid is to blame. Now I don't agree with that. I should not like anyone to BLAME THE TOWX COUNCIL unjustly, because in that case a portion of that blame aught be attached to myself (laughter). seriously he did net think that any of the Council low sitting m the chamber arc really to blame for ,0 r'He tila^ "as been taking place, but the real a;tmeAS t0n 8 attached to the system and nothing r4.k i system'. is the remedy admit- ting tnat the system is wrong. In my opinion the remedy lies m a re-valuation of the town of Car- marthen (applause). Some have been tryinc to noot that down They say it will cost too much ;r^r, 1 life oi me understand anv, one Dcmg so foolish as to make such a statement as that. Assuming lor a moment it is going to ens.: tins town a matter of £ 400, it does not necessarily toUow that .E40U is going to be expended all at once ihe money can be, spread over .several years I would like to draw your attention to what it' ulti- mately means if we increase the rateable value of the town by a matte" of .82,000 It will mean 3 000 6s. lOd. local rates, and with tho poor rate 3,000 9s. 2d., and that is not to be re- covered ior one year, or two or three years but for many years hence And if, as I hope, tho system witi be amended by means of our appoiniino and we have the power of appointing a borough assess- ment committee, then we can look after the affairs more carefully and see that the assessments are ad- justed from time to time. That is one method The first and most important then I come to the countv assessment committee. That is wrong altogether. We are. at present placed at the mercy of this countv assessment committee. Then there Is the assistant overseer, and I intend referring to that later on. ihat wants amending most decidedly (laughter). DEALING WITH THE OVERSEERS, 1 Wi'^ t0 fElir ail<3 ^USt' 1 don't o reflect uP.on the action of the overseers, beyond this my belief that they do not, and have not in the past fully reaJised what was expected of them From what I can glean, and I have got it from the overseers themselves-l am sure they would not try -a xie °" the point—they have simply con- fined their attention to inspecting new buildings and assessing them without due regard to the rents paid. JNow that is not what I consider the duties of an overseer should be. I think they should take into consideration rents to a very much greater decree than they do at present. Then I maintain that°thp overseers have tolerated inconsistencies which f-houk! have been evident to them had thev taken the trouble to inspect the rate collector's' books Mr Williams and I, when we went down and inspected the rate books, we saw very quickly indeed that something was wrong. The whole thing was evi- dent to us. All the injustices and inconsistencies were evident to us very quickly, and I ask, if it was 'de evident to us so speedily, how was it the overseers all these years have had their eyes blind To what was so evident to us? (applause). I want to make it per- fectly clear here, why it was Mr. W llhams and I refei always to rateable value, rather than gross rat- ings. I thought I made it very clear at the Council Chamber that. it was our intention to confine our references to the rateable value of properties we mentioned. I think that is perfectly fair and reason- able for us to make reference aJ! in one direction, in one line, because by so doing we were preventing any confusion of terms and misleading various in- dividuals as to what we are referring to. And not only that, I think you will al! agree with me that the ratepayers of the town are more familiar with rate- able value, and further it is to the rateable value that we have, as a town, to look to in calculating the revenue that will be forthcoming (applause). In any reference I make to-night it is my intention to continue the same practice, and if there is anybody Vtho wishes to know what the gross rating is, aJl ha has to do—and you have ail attended the board school—13 to divide the rateable valua by tour, and when you have the quarter added on, you have the gross rating. It is very simple. I can t understand wny there has been that contusion arising. I notice there is a lot of quibbling going on, and it has oc- curred in respect ot one ot our esteemed local papers. It appears to me that paper looks like holding a brief for the overseers. However i go into tnat, but I noticed one thing in THE JouRXAL which must have been evident to any thinker, and that is that there is a species J of hyster.a permeating those leading articles and leaderettes. In the hrst portion of the leading article reference is made to this being a very good move, and if it succeeds the rates are g-omg down. Then I suppose the writer forgets what be had been writing in the arst part, for in the last po.tion we got the hysterical statement to the duect tnat if we go with this Ratepayers' Association, and go on rising the rateable vajue we are going to drive a lot of people away from the town (laughter) Of course, I say it is pardonable to take that line of action, because I suppose they were forgetting them- selves. Now otner references have been made by a writer under the nom-de-plume of -Lex and he goes on giving the gross of No. 56. He mixes them up, you know, rather badly, but at the same time, though he gave the gross of 26, King-street at :M6 it c'ocs not do away with the fact that every state ment made by Mr. William, was correct He was correct irom the beginning to the end (anplause), and I join Mr. Williams in challenging anybody in this room or in die town, to go over to the borough accountant s omce, examine those books, and nrovo any ot our statements are wrong (applause). Then another gross rating term-1 was gomg to say gross statement (laughter)-another statement was with re- gard to gross rate of No. 15, Queen-street to wircli 1 compared my promises, on wMcIi I had to nay on £ 68, and No. lo is rated at JE24. I point it out Vou see his reference to the gross does not alter the rateable value of No. 15, does it2 I tis exactly the same, and I would say this, that that nroperty is in every way equal in size to my own, excepting tna owner of No. 15 is better og in this resnect, that a matter of about :B25 a year rent frem the Gove-n- ment lor their onlces (laughter). Now I want'to drive this home. If I am long I am sorry to have to take up your time (cries of "Go on"). I want to urivo this home with regard to the gross and rate- able ajue. Ihe legal basis upon which assessments should be made is five per cent, on the cost, which in respect ot big houses is never followed; or the actual rent or the hypothetical rent paid—a rent they nngnt get it they got anybodyo t take the house. I want you to understand that very clearly because tnere area good many mis-statements being mt tn r6S?Ct 10 thesG .ratlnss- Mow 1 am com- i ° a Pomt-' bear "i mind, rent being the basis or the gross rating. I am going to refer toThe .lores now occupied by the Carmarthen Earmers- Co-operatn-e bociety. 1 refer to this, sir, because Lex has referred to them, and he has given the gross rating. Now tiie rent of those stores for a lease of about 21 years is £ 120 a year. "Mr Lex" trT + k gl'?S b01Ug to2 5s' A lot of money ° >ut ky what possible process of arithmetic can anyone make i;82 equal i;120. I faded but perhap. some may succeed laughter and apokuse). fhen the most amusing reference of all in mv opinion, was tnat where he takes hold of my dwell- ing-house—'Castle House-arid he says L rateable value is £ 32 6s., and has a sliding- statement about .omo land I h»ve bohmd, .„d corner"' ft of course, means to compare it with Gwynfryn Now I must say that 1 consider that a most deliberate V tempt to mislead the public and confuse thf refer- ence I made to this property. Everybody who has te". Z,?i\ u»i has a field behind u. I am fortunate to have a field and I make use of it. I should like to exrlm that to Mr lT ?on!?,aeraVt0n neither the field belongmg u,. rL^W1i3\GiWyr,liryn' Vvhich is rated at £ 4 5s nor the field behind my house, which is rated at referred °S £ 1-10i Mr. LeJrit I -arden °* my house With sraa11 garden, with stable assessment separately makin- trr ll f I a;gainsr Gwynfryn, standing in its own grounds, detached from all other buildings alto gether, with garden, coach-house and stable ilto- £ 1 to"' ln ono assessment at £ 40. That is the advantage of \LR T AW'O T J ?J thmk there will be any reference to Castle House m future (laughter and applause). There is another reference made to a house in Francis Well to which 7^' referred. It was stated it was occupied by Mr tk8' afessed Sross> mark you. correct ?hat ?°U aiJow me to and^Shut up ) 16" now (cries of "Sit down" AlrIlTT?rr!lald3~I feeI SUre the Chairman will allow i\V a ry every opportunity. Th; Harrj-I should like (yells of "Sit down") alhiw n!,a>0' f dlshnc% understood I will allow no one to interfere with the speakers (an. pl\fr R' i ou,s'!aU alj| £ fvo an opportunity to reply Richards-Probably the interrupter thou-ht I was going to say Mr. Evans lived there I as nnt going to say. any such thing; "Mr. Lex" said tW THIS house in Irancis Well that is gross rated a1 rented to Vr^n -hlCh %Te 1>aid "P™ £ 14 10s" T ^ii ? Davies at £ o5 a year ("Shame"). x'T5°r^n- V, y°U n?-a,in doe,s £ 18 represent £ 35. If mirfli \h being paid, .surely the ratepayers of Car- n-:d ^fnr A'° fa ng to e' Pect that" rates will be upon that sum accordingly (applause) Now T SSL* *•> A i&STWS'J THE ASSISTANT OVERSKHE. What arc his duties? From what I can sather t tokadv"S0Ontheeatied by readm- ii: UP> his duties'are TO■ advxso the overseers to a certain extent and SL inconsistencies exist it is his duty to draw the attention of the overseers of these discrepancies Ficton-terrace!4 a'nd'" no/° N°' 28' Sir11! lease ateabI° ^enh°Sd thS the ifmin'nir tiiat renovation, Wta» *■» Who, t<> £ 20 -15, (lau^.er ^d apXu °e ? Zr'.ht" should like to point out-and mmd you f! n personal animus against the assistant overseer-I whichme-ristSPii? th« and P°mtin? out inconsistencies ex?st 111 the present rating of th~ town r (laughter) C T °ard of Gu^mda ve'y'ptaiS'f'pWe"0"! fm? PMPIe'»'»* fall upon p.ta„ant places. 1 don t envy them all T ce;ves £ ln0't- n- ^now the assistant overseer re- tor 1 assista?t overseer and poor-rate collec- out the voters' list of tho Z -f-°r ,r;aki!i- of '"•Rub it in, rub ifinflet us hUe riot. Torreef over £ 10? °Pen t0 co"ftion'if f am Gas Comppny-UauehJpri aS collector from the Now that is a verv^ soft spot Ts li^of- ? !v V*0' ill,referenon +„ ih V tA* «ow, having of 'fixiif- it fndelSlv lk has had the effect like to loll ,d hb,y uiJOn your mmd—I should v6 to tell jou how some people are treated who ire lesson, and It ifS a uisachantage to be an assistant overseer (laughter) Now I am going to make an extraordinary inent, and rather a paradoxical one. I am gL'nn to tell you how to get your rates reduced \]J von macVnev0ou°itSth0 °r/easke a house, spend 1 lot of cncy ou it, the more the better perhaps, and down comes tne rateable value (laughter). We have had reference made to prove that. I hardly like to refer to the one made by Mr. Williams last week- out as tne gentleman is here, he will be able to exp.ain how it occurred. I mean the Old College School (laughter and "hear, hear"). The same the1SrprCKl lh°m Monoy was spent on it' yet n!,?;n i Tie wcnt c £ wn- We had that "ex- plained by the JOURNAL. The JOURXAL says if you ti ai i1.0^ vacant fo1' twelve months, and keei> a ..chool tnore, you ought to have it rates free. Now that wr.s a very good way of putting it, but you -now, if you want to he fair and just to everybody /WW Apply it to everybody in like manner (laughter and applause) I am rated in Queen-street At £ 68 a year Well, I employ labour, but I don't rfo it for the benefit of other people. I am hone-it enough 10 assert; I do it for myself. If you are going to apply that argument, I'would a<-k you I would appeal to the JOURNAL and everybody in Car- raton t0 a £ ?lv ''r?'1"7 to me and every other ratepayer. Then I .have got another alteration. There is another house close by my premise, Th of 9ueen-tr^t, No. 43, Spilman-street. that house originally belonged to our family, and for yeaw, as far as I can go, the rates were paid on a rateable value of JB20 7s. 6d. Well that pro- perty wa. sold to a citizen here, and it was practi- ca.)iy renovated from ton to bottom, and I may say instead f.f being an old ancient dwelling, such a<! it was <r our days. It was now being transformed IT"i1° a model dwelling or offices—the offices of Mr John Francis. What happened in that case? Who- ATI"T ^'US to-blame: I know not whose fault it was. All I rcnow_ is what happened. A re-valuation took place, and in that case the overse<"rf.) were at work. and a''ter It was comnleted tile rates were reduced from ;330 7s. 6d. to JE20 (laughter). I would like to draw a. comparison, or rather compare the omoes'of Mr. Francis to those which were va!u<-d bv a govern- ment valuer, the Official Receiver's omces in Queen- street, rated at JB28. Look at that. Then go round into NVt's-square, and come to the offices of Mr. Barker, solicitor. Those oiEccs are rated at JE48. I am not going to deal with the question oi whether Mr. Barker should pay more than JB48. I am only trying to prove conclusively that tba other ofHce is rated tar below its real value. There is one very glaring—that of Carmarthen House. It has been rarcd, and always has been rated at .616. It is situated in the heart of the town—in the main artery of the town. A portion of it has been made into a. lock-up shop, and is rated at .624. I ask you if that, house, and if that. shop is worth .624. Sureiy the other portion is worth more than .616, and surely the whole premises originally were worth more than B16. There is something radically wrong'. There was a house in Barn's-row, named Hetty TIi-ion. It had a frontage of 20 feet v/ith seven bedrooms, and tho rateable value was .615 11s. Appeal was made in that case without eueet. in Waterloo-terrace wo come across a house called Brynhyfryd, with a frontage of 23 feet, and mne bedrooms. It is better equipped then the others, and it was valued at..616 rateable value. An appeal was made, and on the hrst time of the aopeal it wis immediately reduced to .615. There are'some other houses I should like to mention. On Saturday last I came across Nos. 25 and 29, Wood's-row rate- able value .65 5s. The nett rent paid for those houses, after all deductions, is .68 10s. The rateable value acordmg to equitable assessment should be £ 6 10s. That is hardly fair, is it? Now here is an important comparison I w.sh to make. With re- gard to public-houses, and if some of the friends are here, remember I am simply rfeerr.no- to the houses and not to them. The '-Half Moon" proper situated m Dark-gate, rateable value B12 10s The 'Rose and Crown, with extensive premises behind and staohng, .619 5s. The -Falcon," B15 5s., is aiso well fitted up with stabling, and does a good business, I presume. Then we have a house in Pr.o'.y-street-.he "Cart and Horses." I don't know whether our friends know it, but I know It by S1Z 1 is rated at £ 12' "Old Plough," which was sold last year in public sale at £ 1,900, and I am led to believe that a sum of about £ 500 has been spent on it since, is rated at .640. Now for tho sake of comparison, I will ask vou to go a"-ain to Queen-street, and look at the 'Snread Eagle No better frontage, with absolutely no accommoda- t1™ K, "1,kAln \-vhat Is rated at? £ 34, and the x lough -—40. Now, I refer to cases to show that the working classes of the town are rated un to the hilt—people who don t happen to have anybody to put in a word for them. We have the case of No 7 The Avenue, owned by a Miss M. A. Evans. The YfU!rri.1S rated at £ 11 5s., the rent being £ 14. Mrs. ihornas, Priory-street, owns two houses in the Avenue, Nos. 4 and 5, both rated at J614 10s., with rent at .618. Fu)ly rated. Then we have a house m Priory-street, and I can give you innumerable instances. No. Ill, Priory street; occunicr, Miss .hvans; owned by Jesus College: rateable value J37 7s. 6d and rent..610 l&s.. more than which it has never been. Ihcn a house occupied by Mr. Harries 5;M°rley-street, is rated at £ 10 10s., with the rent at £ xi. Then there is a still worse case. The house occupied by Mr. Geo. Phillips, No. 1, The Quav rateable value £ 6 7s. 6d., rent £ 7 4s. (laughter), ihat is what tha working-man has to pay Then with regard to Nos. 21 to 24, and 26, The Avenue all built on the same plan, one of them Is rated at ;&11 5s. and the rest at .610 10s, rent J616 to J618 No consistency whatever. Then wo have the house No. 10, Richmond-terrace, rated at .69 15s., and thj rent .617. Then Nos. 5 and 4, and you can go all the way up and hnd a lot more, just the same thing applies. There are three houses in Union- street which arc somewhat glaring cases of this inconsistent rating. They are No. ila, b, and c- they go altogether you see—rateable value .69 15s rent .616. I am informed that one of the houses is a IKiut be(:o;mng vacant and the landlord is going to ask £ 17 10s. 1 hope the assistant overseer will step in there in the same way as he did with Mi- nnow's house. To conclude I am going to appeal to this meeting, as Mr. Williams has done; I am to appeal to all justice-loving ratepayers oi the town to support us In the attempt we are making to redress wrong (applause). I should like this meeting to let it be clearly understood that what they really want and desire is a re-valuation of the whole of the town by an independent valuer, inde- pendent of the county, or anyone else (applause). I honestly believe, and I have soent many an hour pouring over those books, and I have had the con- viction borne upon me very strongly from the moment I started investigating, that if' we adopt aus plan, ana I consider it is the only nian which will accomplish our purpose, we will 'succeed in getting the assessable value of the town increased by a matter of .65,000 (applause). That will mean oeyond a. doubt, that the ratepayers of the town can look ahead to a reduction in tha rates of from 6d. to Is. almost immediately. Further, I would point out that the tendency will be. for the rates to be reduced still further, because you must rememoer that with an increase of :65,000, tho yield of a, penny will be far greater than at present, and the town is bound to feel the beneSt of it ultimately. I want to have fairplay and justice, and that is all we ask for. We want to make it as impossible as we can for anpeals to .succeed were such appeals are not justiliable. I wonder myself sometimes whether those who live in grand houses, and who can well afford to pay proper, just whether they have really realised what it means when they succeed in their appeals. Have they realised for a moment that every .6100 that they succeed in knocking os the rateable valuo of their property means that the equivalent sum of jElOO is added to the burden of tho long suffering rate- payers. I hardly think, Mr. Mayor, that. they can have given proper attention, or proper thought, to SUM action. I have sumcient faith in human nature myself, to fancy that if those men were to give it sunicient thought of the hardship that might be thrown upon the working classes, they would pause very seriously indeed before they made such an appeal (applause). I think this should be brought forcibly home to them by the decision oi this meeung to-night, and that is by the formation of a Ratepayers' Association—that you have set your shoulders to the wheel, and you are determined uan i'ie futia'e all inconsistencies and injustices shall be swept, away finally, and shall not be allowed to crop up again (applause). Mr. W. Burton, Queen's Hote}, endeavoured to put a, question, but the shouts and yells of "Plat- form and "Speak up" made his remarks in- audible. Eventually the Mayor restored quietude, and Mr. Burton asked the Borough Acountant the rateable value of Queen's Hotel, Queen-street. The Borough Accountant—.672. sir (cries of -'There'' and -'Shame"). The Rev. JoMph Harry, who t-poke amidst a regular dm, said that ho had expected the pariia- mentary right of correcting a mis-statement when it was made, would have been granted to. him Now that mis-statement had fully half-an-hour'a start, and the proverbial lie is very dimcult to catch. He expected the right to bo given the opportunity cf correction as the speaker moved on. The statement Mr. Williams made was that no single councillor supported him in the stand he took. "Now," proceeded Mr. Harry, "I appeal to you, Mr. Mayor, to bear me out when I say that at the Council meeting a member got on his feet and said that the motion had his hearty sympathy and would support it. I expected Mr. Williams, as an honourable gentleman, to deal fairly with Ins fellow members, and I expect him to apologise, and apologise amply to that parti- cular member, for the mis-statement lie has made this evening. The Mayor—In fairness 1o the Rev. Josenh Harry, I must tell you that the Rev. Joseph Harry got up and said he was in perfect sympathy with the object, and I forget the exact words used afterwards, but the implication was that he would support it, and Rev. Joseph Harry—Vote for it. The Mayor—Yes, and vote for it (anplause). Mr. D. E. Williams, amidst rounds of applause. said, "I certainly did overlook these remarks of the Rev. Mr. Harry. I remember perfectly well when he got up he accused me of making mis- statements. When I mentioned the Rev. Harry's premises, what I said was that he had spent, as far as I could glean, about J3200 in improving tho house, and in some extraordinary wav we got tha assessment reduced by £ 6. Mr. Harry—That Is not correct. 1 Mr. Williams—It is correct. Mr. Harry—It is not, and the Borough Accountant is here. Mr/WuHams—I asked Mr. Harry. The Borough Accountant—When were the altera- tionsmade? Mr. Harry—The alterations were made last July, !nd the re-assessment was made Li September. The reduction which Mr. Williams has made Is not accurate In point of actual figures. I appeal to ths reporters, and In the renorta of that Council. meeting, Mr. Williams accused me of appealing to the commissioners. I never did so, and I ask you (Mr. Williams) in public to apologise for such a. statement. Mr. Williams—Don't get so excited, Mr. Harry (laughter and applause). I thmk everybody in the room will bear me out that I said if I had made any mis-statement—cither Mr. Richards or myself— I was here to apologise most amply (loud applause). You have no need to speak to me so crosslv as that, s'r (laughter). I apologise most humbly If I made a mistake. The Borough Accountant—The rateable value was reduced from JE28 to B25 10s. at the September meeting. Mr. Harry—Let me explain mv position in that matter. The Mayor—Certam!y. Mr. Harry—I am not going to enter into any great detail, but as I have been publicly accused directly (cries of "No, no/* and uproar). Well, if not directly, Indirectly accused by both sneakers as having had something to do with the reduction or otherwise of my assessment. I don't see why mv name should have been brought into this question at all. I think you wIH agree with me that pro- perty on tlie Parade has considerably deteriorated in recent years—(hear, hear)—deteriorated both In value and In structure. As a matter of fact the house I purchased on tho Parade had been vacant for a con'.idcrable time, and there Is a gentleman In the room who will bear me out when I say the owner experienced considerable dimcujty In pither selling It or letting' it. When I purchased It I had something In the nature of a bargain, and I am not afraid or ashamed to show my books In that trans- action. If Mr. Richards proceeds on one of his own basis of assessment, the &ctua] outlay, whatever you.r